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<div>Lieber<span style="font-size: 10pt;"> Bert, </span></div>

<div><span style="font-size: 10pt;"><br>
</span></div>

<div><span style="font-size: 10pt;">ich kann nachvollziehen, was du meinst.</span></div>

<div><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Für große Preisunterschiede bei Mieten gibt es in vielen Grundeinkommenskonzepten das Wohngeld (regional modifiziert - wie es jetzt schon - ungenügend - ist, auf Bruttowarmmiete bezogen und individualisiert).</span></div>

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</span></div>

<div><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Natürlich kann auch das Grundeinkommen an einem sehr hohen Maßstab bemessen werden, was einer Förderung strukturell abgehängter Regionen gleich käme.</span></div>

<div><span style="font-size: 10pt;"><br>
</span></div>

<div><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Der weitere Punkt ist, dass der Mietwucher endlich enden muss - jede staatliche Finanzierung dieses Wuchers ist faktisch eine Förderung des Einkommens relativ Einkommensstarker.</span></div>

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</span></div>

<div><span style="font-size: 10pt;">Herzlich, Ronald    </span></div>

<div><span style="font-size: 10pt;"> </span></div>

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            <th align="RIGHT" nowrap="" valign="BASELINE">Betreff:
            </th>
            <td>Re: [Debatte-Grundeinkommen] Wie hoch muss ein
              Grundeinkommen sein? Oder: Das Regelsatzdesaster</td>
          </tr>
          <tr>
            <th align="RIGHT" nowrap="" valign="BASELINE">Datum: </th>
            <td>Mon, 30 Jan 2017 07:56:42 +0100</td>
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            <th align="RIGHT" nowrap="" valign="BASELINE">Von: </th>
            <td>Bert Grashoff <a class="moz-txt-link-rfc2396E" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="mailto:unversoehnt@gmx.de"><unversoehnt@gmx.de></a></td>
          </tr>
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            <th align="RIGHT" nowrap="" valign="BASELINE">An: </th>
            <td><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="mailto:debatte-grundeinkommen@listen.grundeinkommen.de">debatte-grundeinkommen@listen.grundeinkommen.de</a></td>
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<div>Hallo Ronald,</div>

      
<div>du hältst dich hier ja vornehm zurück, hast aber vermutlich
        mitbekommen, dass ich Ausarbeitungen von dir wiederholt gelobt
        und als Lektüre empfohlen habe. Ich finde wirklich, du hast da
        Lob verdient.<br>

      </div>

      
<div>Ohne mir jetzt alle in deinem Netzwerk-Artikel vom 27.01.
        verlinkten Referenzen vergegenwärtigt zu haben, möchte ich
        zumindest grundsätzliche skeptische Fragen dazu aufwerfen, die
        ich hier ebenfalls schon wiederholt angeschnitten habe.</div>

      
<div>Du schreibst in Punkt 2: "Deutlich wird, dass –  trotz
        unterschiedlicher Begründungen dieser Höhen – die Angaben nicht
        sehr stark differieren. Sie bewegen sich in einem Korridor
        zwischen 1.076 Euro und 1.145 Euro netto monatlich". Damit
        suggerierst du, dass derzeit etwa 1.100 Euro als bGE-Höhe bei
        uns im Hinterkopf sein sollten. <br>

      </div>

      
<div>Ich finde die implizite These sehr fragwürdig, dass es im
        gesamten Bundesgebiet ein einheitliches
        Durchschnitts-Preisniveau gibt. Ohne dass ich das ausgewertet
        hätte, habe ich z. B. den Eindruck, dass die Discounter-Preise
        hier auf dem Land in McPom spürbar niedriger sind als in meiner
        Heimatstadt Bremen. Weil es ohnehin der höchste Einzelposten ist
        und dazu sehr einfach zu recherchierende Daten im Netz verfügbar
        sind, will ich mich exemplarisch aber lieber bloß auf die Kosten
        für Unterkünfte konzentrieren. Dein Artikel verweist
        diesbezüglich auf die Durchschnittsmiete gemäß <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="http://dip21.bundestag.de/dip21/btd/18/103/1810337.pdf"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="http://dip21.bundestag.de/dip21/btd/18/103/1810337.pdf">http://dip21.bundestag.de/dip21/btd/18/103/1810337.pdf</a>
        , für einen Singlehaushalt auf 342 Euro. Suchmaschine gibt mir
        das hier als ersten Treffer zu Durchschnittsmieten nach
        Kommunen:
        <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="http://www.spiegel.de/wirtschaft/soziales/mietpreise-in-deutschland-wohnen-in-muenchen-ist-am-teuersten-a-951431.html">http://www.spiegel.de/wirtschaft/soziales/mietpreise-in-deutschland-wohnen-in-muenchen-ist-am-teuersten-a-951431.html</a>
        . Demnach lag die Durchschnittsmiete in München 2013 gut 65 %
        höher als die Durchschnittsmiete im Bundesgebiet. Und ich
        vermute mal, dass München nicht einmal die allerteuerste
        Wohngegend im Bundesgebiet ist. Aus 342 Euro Single-Miete im
        Bundesschnitt werden also 564 Euro Single-Miete im Münchner
        Schnitt, aus 1.076 Euro Existenz- und Teilhabeminimum bei
        Hausstein im Bundesschnitt also 1.298 Euro im Münchner Schnitt.
        Und das nur wegen des einen Postens "Unterkunft". Allein daraus
        würde ich schließen, dass deine Suggestion, es gäbe bei etwa
        1.100 Euro so etwas wie eine 'magische Zahl', zu der
        Armutsrisikogrenzen, Warenkorbmodelle, Pfändungsgrenze und
        BAFÖG-Rückzahlungsgrenze streben, nicht haltbar ist.</div>

      
<div> M. E. folgt aus den vier Kriterien unseres Netzwerks klar,
        dass auch der Posten "Unterkunft" keiner Bedarfsprüfung
        unterworfen werden darf, weil wir eine Unterkunft ja alle
        selbstverständlich als soziokulturell existenzsichernd ansehen.
        Was nutzt uns ein bGE, das zwar im Bundesdurchschnitt
        existenzsichernd sein mag, für Leute in München aber nicht?
        Zudem: Wegen der in Art. 11 GG und Art. 13
        UN-Menschenrechtscharta gewährten Freizügigkeit folgt m. E.
        zwingend, dass ein bGE sich nicht an irgendwelchen
        Bundesdurchschnittswerten abarbeiten kann, sondern
        ausschließlich an den Durchschnittswerten der Kommune, in der
        die soziokulturelle Existenzsicherung am teuersten ist (wegen z.
        B. hoher Mieten, hoher Discounter-Preise, hoher Preise im
        öffentlichen Nahverkehr etc. pp.). Die dem Gesetzgeber in Art.
        72 GG angetragene "Herstellung gleichwertiger Lebensverhältnisse
        im Bundesgebiet" ist hierfür ein zusätzliches Argument:
        Orientiert sich ein bGE am Durchschnitt der teuersten Kommune,
        fließt zusätzliche Kaufkraft in billigere Kommunen, die ja in
        aller Regel billiger sind, weil sie irgendwie unattraktiver
        sind. Zusätzliche Kaufkraft kann diese Unattratkivität
        perspektivisch ausgleichen. Politökonomisch wäre ein solches an
        der teuersten Kommune orientiertes bGE (gerade im europäischen
        Maßstab) zudem ein effektiver surplus recycling mechanism, wie
        ihn Yanis' aus keynsianischer Perspektive stark zu machen
        versucht (vgl. nur z. B.
        <a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="https://yanisvaroufakis.eu/2011/02/09/what-is-a-surplus-recycling-mechanism-an-idea-going-back-to-bretton-woods/">https://yanisvaroufakis.eu/2011/02/09/what-is-a-surplus-recycling-mechanism-an-idea-going-back-to-bretton-woods/</a>
        und den dortigen Link auf das dritte Kapitel seines
        Minotaurus-Buchs).</div>

      
<div>Ist es also nicht unbezweifelbar, dass wir uns zur Ermittlung
        einer angemessenen bGE-Höhe darauf konzentrieren sollten: Wie
        hoch ist das soziokulturelle Existenzminimum in der teuersten
        Kommune im Bundesgebiet (bzw. innerhalb der EU)?</div>

      
<div>Liebe Grüße,</div>

      
<div>Bert<br>

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      <br>

      
<div class="moz-cite-prefix">Am 29.01.2017 um 18:21 schrieb <a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="mailto:rblaschke@aol.com"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-abbreviated" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="mailto:rblaschke@aol.com">rblaschke@aol.com</a>:<br>

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                                                      sans-serif"><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="https://www.grundeinkommen.de/27/01/2017/wie-hoch-muss-ein-grundeinkommen-sein-oder-das-regelsatzdesaster.html"></a><a class="moz-txt-link-freetext" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="https://www.grundeinkommen.de/27/01/2017/wie-hoch-muss-ein-grundeinkommen-sein-oder-das-regelsatzdesaster.html">https://www.grundeinkommen.de/27/01/2017/wie-hoch-muss-ein-grundeinkommen-sein-oder-das-regelsatzdesaster.html</a></font></div>

                                                  
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                                                        zu Wie hoch muss
                                                        ein
                                                        Grundeinkommen
                                                        sein? Oder: Das
Regelsatzdesaster" style="margin: 0px; padding: 0px; text-decoration:                                                        none; color:                                                        rgb(213, 28,                                                        23);" target="_blank" href="https://www.grundeinkommen.de/27/01/2017/wie-hoch-muss-ein-grundeinkommen-sein-oder-das-regelsatzdesaster.html">Wie
                                                        hoch muss ein
                                                        Grundeinkommen
                                                        sein? Oder: Das
Regelsatzdesaster</a></h2>
                                                    
<div class="metadata" style="margin-bottom:                                                      3px; font-stretch:                                                      normal; font-size:                                                      13px; line-height:                                                      1.5; font-family:                                                      Georgia, Times,                                                      serif; color:                                                      rgb(68, 68, 68);                                                      background-color:                                                      rgb(255, 255,                                                      255);">27.01.17 | <span class="autor" style="margin:                                                        0px; padding:                                                        0px;">von Ronald
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<div id="post-12533" class="post-12533
                                                      post type-post
                                                      status-publish
                                                      format-standard
                                                      hentry
                                                      category-hintergrund
category-startseite
tag-existenzsicherung tag-grundeinkommen tag-hoehe-des-grundeinkommens
                                                      tag-teilhabe" style="margin: 0px                                                      0px 1.5em;                                                      padding: 0px 0px                                                      2px; overflow:                                                      hidden;                                                      font-family:                                                      Arial, Tahoma,                                                      "Trebuchet                                                      MS",                                                      Helvetica,                                                      sans-serif;                                                      font-size: 15px;                                                      background-color:                                                      rgb(255, 255,                                                      255);">
                                                      
<div class="artikel" style="margin:                                                        0px; padding:                                                        0px; overflow:                                                        hidden;"><b>Der
                                                          Streit um die
                                                          Höhe des
                                                          Regelsatzes
                                                          bei den
                                                          Grund­siche­rungen
                                                          verdeckt, dass
                                                          deren
                                                          Berechnungsmethode
                                                          grundsätzlich
                                                          fragwürdig
                                                          ist.</b></div>

                                                      
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<div class="artikel" style="margin:                                                        0px; padding:                                                        0px; overflow:                                                        hidden;"><b>Alternative
Möglich­keiten, das Existenz- und Teilhabe­minimum in Deutschland zu
                                                          bestimmen,
                                                          werden
                                                          aufgezählt und
                                                          Höhen benannt:
Armutsrisiko­gren­ze, Warenkorb, Pfändungs­frei­gren­ze und
                                                          BAföG-Rückzahlungsbefreiung. </b></div>

                                                      
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<div class="artikel" style="margin:                                                        0px; padding:                                                        0px; overflow:                                                        hidden;"><b>Sie
                                                          bewegen sich
                                                          um die 1.110
                                                          Euro. <a style="margin:                                                          0px; padding:                                                          0px;                                                          text-decoration:                                                          none;" target="_blank" rel="noopener noreferrer" href="https://www.grundeinkommen.de/27/01/2017/wie-hoch-muss-ein-grundeinkommen-sein-oder-das-regelsatzdesaster.html">Mehr
                                                          ...</a></b></div>

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                  </div>

                </font></div>

            </div>

          </div>

        </font> </blockquote>
      <br>

    </div>

  

</div>

</div>




</div>
</font>